Fostering that mentality would also fashion that spirituality of the wanting like a child – grabbing for something [in this case forgiveness] with no thought to the meaning of the need. Although – I have to add the caveat here that as a christian judging is forbad – who can say whether or not folk in the moment mean there conversion when they finally make it. I cannot honestly say that no-one couldn’t…

But the axe wielding murderer … this is interesting. (Honest) With debates when folk go on about if someone ‘believes’ in Jesus they are saying nothing less of Satan [I don't know hwo you feel about the old christian world view but it does go to the core of the idea] – so believeing in itself means nothing – it is the reaction of the axe wielding murderer -

Either they think that what they did was right and therefore don’t need forgiveness for their act and so on – which I’ll say is to believe but ignore – we all know someone we’d rather not see…

Or they think that what they did was wrong – here there are two more possibilities… Out of Pride or some other characteristic they may decide that asking for forgiveness is not for them – which shows no real change…

On the other hand of the axe wielding murderer did indeed experience conversion then that means three things – belief in Jesus (we are still experiencing the christian universe here) – repentance, which means acknowledging our faults and ways that might not be the best and turning to Jesus and pledging not to return to these things – and the scandal of forgiveness as St Paul put it….

The story doesn’t entirley stop there – re parable of sower etc but if you keep ‘walking with God’ to use a good old Old Testemant phrase, then whilst you may stumble and sometimes become lost – then you should be confident in the continuing of your relationship with God and that includes onrolling forgiveness through our lives.

The fundamental under pinning of this is the idea/reality (take your pick) that Jesus took all the legitimate punishment for the whole of creation and therefore what we have done wrong and what we will do are both ‘covered’…

This is a bit long and I hope you don’t mind but I have tried to give a clear and possibly encyclopedic overview of both the issues and the christian take on the question of

“the argument against Christianity citing the example of an axe-murderer who suddenly repents at the last minute: should he be absolved by believing in Jesus?”

Which is sometimes a sullen well – How can that be fair? the answer is – it ain’t fair but that’s God for you… the flipside is that most folk will then back away from the retort that if they were the axe wielding murderer then they could have that forgiveness, saying that they wouldn’t deserve it – which for everyone is the point – no-one deserves it its a gift and I’m rambling on ever more…

If you’re not put off by long rambling comments ask away if there’s something else tinkering away – of course if this comment is just too long – feel free to read to the end and delete!

I know of Go, but never played it. My associate, Thrig has played a little, and he thought it was quite hard.

I do recall the parable of the sower, but I never appreciated the meaning you cited. That’s certainly a good point.

I often hear the argument against Christianity citing the example of an axe-murderer who suddenly repents at the last minute: should he be absolved by believing in Jesus? I really don’t know the answer to that one, but I’ve heard debate this question quite a bit.

In Pure Land Buddhism, it does actually say in one Buddhist sutra, the Contemplation Sutra, that if one repents very sincerely at the end of their life, and takes refuge in Amida Buddha, they will find redemption and be born in the Pure Land, though not right away (they’ll exist in a lotus blossom that doesn’t bloom for a long time).

But Shinran is smart in saying that you can’t rely on what would happen at the end of your life; who knows when you’ll die? So, better to repent and take refuge now.

Though those who profess their ‘conversion’ to Christ and then change not a jot are obviously not mindful of what it means to follow Jesus’ teachings – they may even be genuine in their moment of conversion but then we have the ‘parable of the sower’ which is a warning to us all not to be shallow…

Of course within christianity there are folk who argue that what we receive in regards to forgiveness from God is both unfair and unending as we do nothing to deserve it – and in some ways they are right – Who amongst us despite trying to walk the ‘higher way’ do not stumble? and therein we can find comfort.

Apart from wondering what your thoughts are in this regard are I would also like to know if you are familiar in any way with Go?